Is Vet Med Confusing Resilience with Endurance? | The Founders of Boop

What if the problem in veterinary medicine isn’t that we need to be more resilient, but that we’ve gotten really good at enduring things we shouldn’t have to?

In this special episode of Don’t Call Me Catty, Leilani and Jillian sit down with boop co-founders Amanda Ensor, DVM, Ashleigh White, and Rachelle Richard to talk about how an idea for veterinary apparel became something much bigger.

The conversation gets into the leadership problem in vet med, why wellbeing initiatives can only go so far when the workplace itself isn’t working, the lack of space to process the emotional weight of the profession, and what it actually takes to build teams where people feel supported.

They also talk about preparing new grads for the realities of practice without scaring them away, why veterinary professionals need to talk to each other instead of at each other, and boop’s mission to use apparel, community, and a little bit of humour to push the profession forward.

Plus: founder friendship, financially feral behaviour, questionable spending advice, rapid-fire questions, and some very spicy hot takes.

boop may have started with what you wear on your chest, but the real conversation is about what veterinary medicine should stand for.

Support boop 

Shop | Instagram 

About The Founders 

Amanda Ensor, DVM

As a practicing DVM and recognized thought leader, Dr. Amanda's connection to the boop mission is personal: she's lived it. The long shifts, the emotional weight, the gap between how hard vet teams work and how rarely that gets acknowledged.

At boop, she's our steward of wellbeing: the reason everything we put out reflects the real texture of veterinary life, not a polished version of it. She also leads partnerships with organizations like the Veterinary Hope Foundation and Reviving Vet Med.

Never without a book and a water bottle roughly the size of a small aquarium. hydration and high standards — non-negotiable.

Ashleigh White, PHR

With a background in HR and talent acquisition, Ashleigh has spent years helping hospitals grow their teams, developing a deep appreciation for the people behind the profession—their dedication, resilience, and sense of humour. 

At boop, she leads product — making sure everything we create reflects the culture of vet med, from the inside jokes to the everyday realities.

When she’s not working on boop, you can find her traveling, gardening, or spending time with the animals who inspired it all.

Rachelle Richard, MBA

With a background in leadership and operations, Rachelle has spent decades building and supporting healthy, high-trust teams across human health and vet med.

At boop, she leads operations - the connective tissue between the vision and the reality of running it.

Rachelle also founded goodvet.ca - a Canadian veterinary recruitment consultancy built on the principle that who you work with shapes how you experience this profession.

Powered by infectious laughter and an unwavering commitment to booping every dog she encounters. Also, she has found a new tech tool and yes, she will tell you all about it.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Don't Call Me Caddy. We are here at Social Launch Labs with

Meet the Founders of Boop

SPEAKER_00 0:04

the founders of Boop. We have Ashley, we have Dr. Amanda, we have Rochelle.

SPEAKER_04 0:11

Thanks so much for being here, guys. And you know, we had to represent as well with our poop apparel. That everybody's wearing poop.

SPEAKER_02 0:25

So good.

SPEAKER_04 0:26

I love it. I'm about 35 degrees too hot right now. Yeah, it's pretty warm.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

You really hid that from us for a while.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

We did. We we we were looking, we love any type of drama that we can bring. That's true. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 0:41

I was trying to, you know, before.

SPEAKER_04 0:43

Oh, what an intro. The color looks great on both of these. We literally were just saying that when we put it on, I was like, I love this color. Yeah. So um we thank you so much for being here, guys, in Calgary, Alberta. We're so lucky because y'all are from all over the place, but not Calgary. So I would love if you guys could all do a little intro of yourselves because you, although you're all founders of Boop, you're also in the veterinary industry outside of Boop. So if each of you could give us a little bit of an intro, what you did before launching Boop and uh and where you're from as well.

SPEAKER_08 1:20

I love it.

SPEAKER_04 1:21

You're looking at me, so I'm gonna start.

SPEAKER_08 1:22

We are gonna start. Yeah, I'm Ashley White, and I currently live in Texas. So I am so happy to be in Canada for a long time little reprieve. No, no sports.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

I can smell sports. All right.

SPEAKER_08 1:39

Right now, go FIFA. There you go. Yeah. Um my sort of entry into the veterinary industry was through National Veterinary Associates, where I built early career recruiting programs. So I've worked for a few companies now doing just that. Um working with veterinary new grads at, you know, a really pivotal time in their careers where they are, you know, launching themselves into this profession, choosing their first hospital teams, their first culture, um, and getting a really unique vantage point of, you know, being able to watch them start their careers and rooting for them and wanting so much for this profession and their first teams to honor all of the work that they had poured in to get to that place and wanting for their experience to uh be wonderful and for them to feel supported and um really happy with the way that their careers are launched and knowing that sometimes, you know, there might be a gap between what we're wishing for them and what their lived experience might be is a bit of you know my why for for why I'm here and why I have such a deep reverence for the profession and you know care so much about the humans in in this space and everything that they carry, um, and really wanting the best for them.

SPEAKER_04 3:08

Amazing. Thanks so much, Ashley.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

I was gonna cry. You were gonna cry. So I was like, wait, is she like holding it in, caring about the humans? Love it. The tears might come. They will. Yeah. It's normal. They will.

unknown 3:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:21

Dr. Amanda is up next.

SPEAKER_06 3:23

Yeah, so I'm Dr. Amanda Enzer, and I am the veterinarian on our team. I've been, I guess, officially a veterinarian since 2012. I'm from Knoxville, Tennessee, and that's where I've been pretty much most of my life. So I grew up there and I spent a brief period of time after school in Nashville doing an internship, but I've primarily spent most of my career in general practice. So small animal working at um one extremely toxic hospital was like the vast majority of my early years, and can't say that they were well supported, which is probably why I continued my journey into finding out how I could support others. Um, but in doing that, relief work, I ended up also starting a mentoring organization for women in my community. And it just spanned all different career types. I didn't make a penny doing it, but I just really needed to see other people, especially women, championing other women, you know, supporting them and seeing what could happen when that happens. So I was connected with some really incredible people, and I really got to learn how to be a better mentor to doctors who were around me too, um and other support staff members. So that was just a kind of a unique experience while I was doing relief work. And then I found National Veterinary Associates because they started this mentoring organization. And so that would be a full-time role to support other doctors. And I thought, wow, that's incredible. Um, tell me more. And they couldn't tell me anything about what the role would be like because we were basically building this plane as we were flying it, um, had no idea how much travel there might be. Um, I was always gone, never home. But it was amazing to cover eight different states and helped over 60 doctors who were kind of within one to five years of graduation. So I would go to their hospital and six zero. Six zero doctors and eight states, eight licenses, too. That was probably one of the lowest points of having to get all of those. That was a headache. Uh but it was amazing to be able to have the perspective of what different practices were like across the country. So, with that experience, I probably worked in over a hundred different hospitals. So, yeah, it was amazing to see what good environments really were like and what people both people were capable of when they were supported. And I think that was like the number one thing I saw is that when it just we'll probably get into it later, but just seeing great leadership and what that actually looked like and learning a lot from bad leadership. So I did that for about three years, and then I was promoted to our clinical learning team, where I had the opportunity then to help all of our hospitals and help the leaders in those hospitals. Because many of us who find ourselves in a leadership position were given zero training and zero time to lead. You're just running the hospital or just trying to, you know, get through the day, take care of the patients, that it's very rare that you're offered or even think to get the time to think about your team members, what the business needs. So it was great to be able to share the experience of what I saw great leaders do and to learn from more of them as I kind of help them foster their leadership and create better work environments so that we could continue to do this. Um, but in that NBA role, I was able to meet these lonely ladies. So it was really great to be able to be exposed to what recruiting was like too, because in my early days, that wasn't a thing. Um, so it was really interesting to not only like learn the ins and outs, because I worked pretty hand in hand with Ashley, especially when it came to campus recruiting events. Like, I don't know if it gets more fun than being able to hang with that students. And so I got to do a lot of that, you know? And of course it just lights you up inside because you get to be around them. But that's a bit of my journey, and I'm sure we'll get into more.

SPEAKER_04 7:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 7:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:18

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 7:19

Great, Rochelle. My background is in human health. So I spent most of my career in senior living and opening new retirement homes across the country. Um, my background's in operations and leadership. So I um I came over to NVA through a Headhunter to help NVA Canada and National Veterinary Associates Canada build their portfolio as they were growing through the Canadian uh market. Um so I was responsible for um a little under 20 practices in eastern Ontario and supporting those teams to enter a corporate company. They had just been private, and then overnight they became a part of a corporate cog system. Um and my role was just to support them in understanding how they fit in. And I saw my role as kind of building community in that portfolio of practices because we've all like seen those privately owned practices heads down. When they finally lift up their head to take a look around, I think they find themselves quite isolated when when they're not in a in a big uh group and have community with each other just down the street. Um so I was in operations for most of my time at NVA. I ended up moving into the recruitment team and supported a um recruitment team of DVM and um veterinary technician recruiters. And that's when I met Ashley and Amanda through the campus recruiting function. So I'm the Canadian rep in in our relationship. I represented NBA Canada, and now in our founder relationship, I represent Canada, and here we are in Calgary. I've convinced them to come up. Um and aren't they enjoying their time so much? Yes, we may never go home. Well, get to the foot spa, Jillian.

SPEAKER_08 9:00

There's been highs and lows.

How the Boop Founders Met

SPEAKER_04 9:02

So what what year was this that y'all met then?

SPEAKER_08 9:05

It's so funny that you asked that because we just had to like calibrate and align and get the dates, right? Because we feel like we've been on such a journey together. We feel like we've known each other for so long, but we really only met at the end of 2023.

SPEAKER_09 9:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_08 9:19

Uh, during a a recruiting trip. We can kind of get into the where we met story if you'd like to. Sure. So we all worked for NBA. Um, of course, I was the leading camp leading the campus recruiting team, and we had just started recruiting new grad vets from the UK schools. So London, Glasgow, Edinburgh. So I was planning these trips to the UK where we were hosting events, and in the fall of 2023, I got to invite both Dr. Enzer and Rochelle to the UK. And I had worked with them both really closely but separately, and they had never met each other. And I knew from the beginning that this was going to be magic and that they were immediately going to hit it off and adore and enjoy working with each other the same way that I enjoyed and, you know, loved working with them too. Um, I had planned a very ambitious schedule for this recruiting trip. I mean, we all had alignment, we all had a part in like giving the yes, this is something that we're gonna be able to do. But we planned this trip where we hosted nine events in seven days, three cities, two countries.

unknown 10:36

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

That is an epic girls trip.

SPEAKER_08 10:38

There were planes, there were trains, there were cars, there were Ubers, there was changing in the train station bathroom, running across the city to grab the rental car to get to the lunch and learn on time.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

Fitting in high tea, fitting in a castle visit, and a massive parking ticket. Thank you, NVA. Um they paid for it, right? We don't know. None of my business.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

We need to go international.

SPEAKER_04 11:11

Well, we totally hear that when wherever we go, there's costume changes and chaos and it's like three weeks ago, Leilani was like, we had to change.

SPEAKER_00 11:20

So I'm like changing in the gas station parking lot. She's like, I'll just change the U-Haul, thank you. And she's like, You just shut the door a little bit. And I'm like, no one saw anything. Sorry, we figured it out. Yeah, yeah. You do what you gotta do sometimes.

unknown 11:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 11:35

Sound sounds epic. Okay.

SPEAKER_08 11:37

So you guys were on this this epic journey. Yes, and what a bonding experience it was. Because it was just the three of us. And I mean, we made magic that trip. We crossed all the Ts, dotted all the I's, hosted some amazing events, connected with incredible students. Um, but it was a schlep from morning till night. Um, and we really had so much time to bond over both work and play.

SPEAKER_02 11:59

And so much opportunity for conflict and being together for what, 13 days straight, was it? Of, you know, and and really we we we really just vibed and left the trip as best friends. Yes. But we didn't leave the trip as best friends. There was still a little bit of a question of like, would this, you know, when you leave a trip and you're like, we're gonna stay friends forever. But then the reality of life comes in where you all kind I we all kind of had a healthy optimism that we would be in touch and we would maintain the connection, but it was yet to be seen. But we did.

SPEAKER_00 12:30

She's the realest of the group.

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Oh, totally. I'm group person.

SPEAKER_00 12:33

You're like me. You're like, yeah, we're like best teaching.

SPEAKER_07 12:37

Yeah, and then she's like, hold on, it's true. Bring us back to Earth. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Yes, that's true. But you shared something in San Diego a few months ago about how um the bond as we got home was really like a a group, a group effort. And that was just really reaffirming that all of us really wanted to stay close and build the connection, and we did. And we all had sort of equal parts ownership in that.

SPEAKER_08 13:04

Particularly when we were no longer coworkers, right? Because shortly after that, you know, we all, you know, took on other professional endeavors, other paths. So the testament to the friendship was that there were consistent FaceTimes and check-ins and the text thread consistently popping off even when we were no longer talking about work and it was like more of a transition into just personal friendship. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:30

Yeah. I I and

From Friendship to Founding Boop

SPEAKER_04 13:32

I love what you said about how there was all of this chaos, but there was also work to get done. And then there was fun to be had because you're in, you know, different countries, and that is such a founder thing, right? Like that's all about being an entrepreneur and starting a business. Is like, can you thrive in chaos and still get the work done and still have fun? And so it sounds like that was a great setup for for boot, but I'm curious what was so you guys went on this trip, but then you went on your own endeavor. So what was the aha moment?

SPEAKER_06 14:08

I'm gonna take it. Well, so of course that trip solidified that we knew how to work and play so well together. And I think we could all collectively say that it was um a very naive approach of having an idea of just creating an apparel company that um, you know, we had researched, no one else has done anything like this for maybe just the purpose of bringing joy to this industry. Like that's really where it started. Um, and we really thought, like, oh, like people are just throwing up websites every day. How hard could it be? Right?

SPEAKER_07 14:41

How hard could it be?

SPEAKER_04 14:43

We'll shop it up by Friday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:45

I still don't know how shop up by Woods.

SPEAKER_04 14:48

You guys are so you guys had like an L Woods moment from We did one like what? Like it's hard.

SPEAKER_00 14:53

Exactly. Well, it's well, by the way.

SPEAKER_06 14:57

Not yet. I can't wait.

SPEAKER_00 14:59

So I can't buy pinch day because I've been sick for three weeks.

SPEAKER_06 15:01

So I'm like, okay, I can't wait. We'll do.

SPEAKER_00 15:04

Because it will give you that it's hard. My line is actually better.

SPEAKER_06 15:09

Yeah. And as we were on like different paths and different endeavors from you know, leaving the the the workplace that we met, um, we found that we were also able to have the bandwidth to really lean into this. I think that's the crazy part, is that that's often not something that you're gonna find in another person to say, I can jump into this like fully for a while just to see what we can create together. And then very quickly we realize that this is gonna be a whole lot more than just a little apparel company that maybe brings a smile to someone's face. Like there's some good stuff that we could do here.

SPEAKER_02 15:44

Almost like it has to be so much more than just an apparel. Like we owe it to the profession as we're thinking about what does this mean to us? What do we want on the shirt? Actually, became what do we believe in and what is our mission? And and so we kind of talk about like wear it on your chest as being a big part of how we think about what goes on our apparel, because we are we're on a mission to unite the profession. Um, but we're gonna do it through apparel and we're gonna have fun doing it.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

And you put your heart on your sleeve. Yeah, right? Because all vets that I work with and text, that's where it is. Yeah. Yeah.

The Meaning Behind the Boop Mantras

SPEAKER_04 16:20

So can we can we go through what you guys are wearing right now? So we can these are just some of the mantras, but I'd love to hear more. But let's go through. So Ashley's got Be Kind to Your Vet Team.

SPEAKER_00 16:31

Pain Management is my superpower.

SPEAKER_05 16:33

Love it.

SPEAKER_04 16:34

That must be a new one. It is.

SPEAKER_05 16:36

It is our recent drop.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

Love it. Perfect. And then here to heal with a new color as well that I'm obsessed with. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's actually like a really good horseback riding hat. I wear a helmet, but bar hat? Yes. Right? Because horses are healing. It's like the perfect. Equine vets need it.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

We, as we think about the mantras, we think about who would resonate wearing it. This is not just for veterinarians. This is not just for the folks on the team. This is this is for everyone that identifies with the mantra. And so love that you see, you don't have to be a veterinarian to be here to heal. Not at all. No, and I'm not a veterinarian, but I'm here to heal.

SPEAKER_06 17:16

I'm here to but that's something unique that you know has been kind of a really pleasant surprise as we've been coming up with these on our own and by receiving them from the vet community because we this is a very collaborative approach of wanting the vet community to feel like they're building this with us. It's not just us. But that everyone kind of has maybe a different spin and a take on what this mantra means to them. So that's been really interesting to hear.

SPEAKER_00 17:44

So you guys each, I mean, you're all very different humans and you have different approaches. So, what are each of your unique skill sets that you bring back to this team where it's not like you're stepping on each other's toes? Like it's literally we're different and it's coming together.

SPEAKER_02 17:59

What I love about the three of us, and I'll never stop yelling at from the rooftops, is our differences actually make us so much stronger. And these two women are the first people in my professional career that I'd be super happy for them to do the interview with the New York Times. And I don't, I don't they're gonna represent Boop and me super well, and I'm gonna represent each of them so mightily. And they're all just they're both just so capable in different ways. And our strengths and the the variation of our strengths, they're always kind of highlighted in in the work that we do. We always have very different takes on it, but if they are diverging, we find consensus, it's respectful, but it's also so highly capable. We are all we're often like, we're so fun and we're so we're so impressive.

SPEAKER_08 18:48

Like we have our job is just hyping each other.

SPEAKER_04 18:50

Yeah, absolute hype girl energy from morning until night. Well, it sounds like sisterhood too, really. It feels like it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:57

Sister, sister.

SPEAKER_04 19:00

I have a twin sister. We used to perform that every year as a dollars with the sister when I was little.

SPEAKER_05 19:06

I love that. So funny saying the sister's on the animal. No, with a stuffed animal. Of course.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

Is there a picture of this that we can like pop up?

SPEAKER_05 19:22

I'm sure I can find animation. Oh, well, hold on.

SPEAKER_00 19:26

So I'm bringing you into this. Oh no. So when I met you, because I met you through NBA and you told me you were on American Idol, Canadian Idol. And then I have a doctor client. I swear to God to this day, she told me she was also on Canadian Idol. So they were all in Vegas. We're all in Vegas, and I think they should meet. I totally thought they should meet. And I'm like, yeah, don't worry, she was on she was on idol too. And then you say that to her, and she's like, I wasn't on idol.

SPEAKER_02 19:56

Me? Not you, the other one. Oh.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

And I was like, I swear.

SPEAKER_02 19:59

You remembered it wrong, or she forgot that she said something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 20:03

I don't know about this word, or I just made it up in my head that she was on idle and you were unidable and that you two need to meet. That's what I the narratives that come out of your big beautiful brain are just incredible.

SPEAKER_04 20:13

Sometimes I'm like, Did that actually happen? She has so many one liners. I someone on the podcast and she's like, I mean, you were in a hot tub once.

SPEAKER_07 20:25

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 20:31

Anyway, anyway, I went to the show. It's fine. This is better. Listen, like we call ourselves the Hot Mess Express because that's what we are. I'm here for it. Yeah, it's so fun.

SPEAKER_04 20:41

Oh yeah. And speaking of like different, you know, having different strengths, that's like us and Kaylee. Kaylee, our producer Kaylee, like takes our crazy visions and makes them into reality because she's actually detail orient.

SPEAKER_00 20:55

We're just like, can you make this happen? What if we had a purple dinosaur with wings and a unicorn flying on the podcast?

SPEAKER_01 21:05

She figured it out. There's gonna be an edit image or something like that.

SPEAKER_06 21:08

I mean, that's Rochelle for us, right? Like she makes it happen. She makes it happen. Yes, yes. She shows us what we're capable of. And maybe when we're in the cloud, she's like, no, pwn in. Right. She's the real best way.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

She is the realist. Okay, so you're optimistic. You're not a pessimist.

SPEAKER_02 21:23

I would think so. Yeah. You're you're an optimist. You're a optimist.

SPEAKER_08 21:28

Yeah. She's also like a strategic visionary. Like I think Rochelle is keeping us zoomed out, looking at the big picture, tracking towards goals when we sometimes could like get stuck in the weeds. Like and say yes to everything. A lot of respect to people for us. It's working.

SPEAKER_07 21:47

It is working. Worth every penny bit.

SPEAKER_02 21:50

And vice versa. Like there's lots of ideation. I'm just I'm not as creative as these two in terms of like the big vision, the creation of the product with Ashley. Leads our product in terms of making the words come to life. And Amanda is sort of like our north star in terms of what actually gets pitched and goes out to the world. Uh it goes through Amanda because she is the tone, like the tone, the messaging, how it's going to land for everyone. Um, so she keeps us on track that way too.

SPEAKER_08 22:21

Leading with heart in everything that we do, which has been so powerful and meaningful. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:26

Telling you, you guys need to put a heart on the sleeve. We do kind of.

SPEAKER_06 22:30

I mean, the boob logo itself, you could maybe find a heart in it, but we're very obsessed with the logo itself. Oh, yeah, the logo. It's pretty fun.

SPEAKER_08 22:36

Yeah. But we're noting that on the idea list.

SPEAKER_06 22:38

Yes, we are.

SPEAKER_08 22:39

Very easy.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

Wow. Heart on our sleeve. I do have a shirt that says I wear my heart on my sleeve is here, and it's just images of my dogs up the sleeve. That was an Instagram purchase. That was an Instagram purchase that actually turned out. We love that. That's a good one.

SPEAKER_04 22:52

So, so we've got uh so we talked about some of the oh and we're wearing professional cooperator. Yeah. Professional paper. Um my favorite one though, I still have to buy this one, is fluids before peeling. So that's my favorite one. Yeah. I love that you just said that. Yeah. Because I'm an ER girly. And so I'll tell you sometimes what would have to happen, well, always what would have to happen is you literally have to compartmentalize because I can't be sobbing while I'm trying to get an Ivy catheter and a crashing patient. Sometimes I'd still cry on the way home. But during that time, I was in the zone and I can get it done and I can save this patient that fluids before feelings. That's how I see that one. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 23:33

I didn't know you you guys donated a shirt for our booth.

SPEAKER_04 23:37

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

And PEI. Yeah. So attractions. Yeah. So Lilani's like, look, this is what poopsign does. And I'm like, I don't actually know what that means.

SPEAKER_09 23:45

And she's like, Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

What? And I'm like, it's so she explains to me. I'm like, so a feral cat, basically. Am I feeling feral today?

SPEAKER_04 23:54

Kind of. Doesn't just have to be.

SPEAKER_00 23:56

No, but it was like it just a vibe.

SPEAKER_04 23:59

It's a vibe.

SPEAKER_06 23:59

And it's definitely one of our best sellers. People love it.

SPEAKER_04 24:02

I was gonna ask, yeah, what is your what is your best seller that?

Be Kind to Your Vet Team

SPEAKER_06 24:05

Yeah, feeling fractious, this be kind to your vet team. Like if there's any mantra that really is our nor star, it's this, right? Because this goes so far beyond just the vet professionals, yeah. Which is hopefully where you know we want to take boob as well, for it to have a big stage for the world to recognize the vet professions and the humans behind this really incredible, very important, stressful work. And that maybe when you're going through like those times where we obviously see clients often on their worst days. Yeah. And so that often is going to bring your not so great self to, you know, those interactions with the vet team. And then maybe in that moment, if you're just kind of really aware of the state of our profession, maybe you'll just lean in with a little bit more kindness.

SPEAKER_00 24:48

It's so funny you say that because that's literally when we watched the news. There's a news thing that came out last January, and I called Leilani at I don't know, midnight, which I'm never up at midnight, by the way. It's like I'm in bed and the night owl. And she's the night owl, and I'm like, we need to start the podcast. Like, and I want to come from it from the human side of a non-DVM person being like, how do we educate Canadians just to be more understanding of what actually goes on? And Leilani is the medical side of it, right? So like bringing that together because both are equally important.

SPEAKER_02 25:20

Was that the marketplace? Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:22

It was, it was because I I I I have a I I talked about this on one of our other episodes. It's like I feel like there's like this disconnect between us and our clients right now that is and a distrust, honestly, as well. That's going both ways. But in reality, we have so much in common. Like these are people that share the same human-animal bond that we do, and they make us lucky enough that we get to de dedicate our careers to doing this. So we really wanted to do something where we could bring veterinary voices to uh the other veterinary professionals, but also the people who love the animals too.

SPEAKER_06 26:03

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Yeah. Because I'm a consumer. Like I I mean, I have a vet for my frog, I have a vet for my horses, I have a vet for my dogs. And like that's the one thing you all have in common, like Relani said. Like, you're all here for the common good. Yeah. We're trying to but then from like I'm a financial advisor and I try to educate the vet teams on money, it's like the most stigmatized topic there is. Right. And you the community is dealing with that on the consumer side. So you have someone come in who maybe lost their job or um has a financial hardship for whatever reason, and now we have a six hundred dollar bill to euthanize their best friend. And it's like you guys are talking about money every day to people who are struggling with it just as much as the vet teams are.

SPEAKER_06 26:49

More so now than ever. Ever.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

It's and like the world is expensive.

SPEAKER_06 26:52

Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:54

But mental health and finances are the two most stigmatized topics you can talk about, right? People will talk about sex, politics, religion, and now COVID before they'll talk about money or mental health. Agreed. Yeah. I found a soapbox. I know. It's literally my thing.

SPEAKER_04 27:09

It's a valid one. And on that topic, um, so Amanda on that topic. So, Amanda, I met you um when you were giving a talk about mentorship and actually uh intergenerational um uh success, I guess, like in the workplace. Um and obviously mental health came came up with that topic too. I was blown away by it. I thought you did such a great job. And I was also wearing animal health, like we have a shirt where it's like a skeleton booping a cat. It's so cute. Actually, same sort of intro. I opened up my jacket, was like, look what I'm wearing.

SPEAKER_03 27:50

You're showing your boobs. Because you you introdued boop everyone with a breast.

SPEAKER_04 28:01

Okay. Okay. Um, and so uh so so I mean you talk about that a lot, obviously in the work you've done that comes up a lot, but also in your career, right? Like the things that you went through earlier in your career and and probably throughout.

SPEAKER_09 28:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:14

Um,

What Vet Med Gets Wrong About Wellbeing

SPEAKER_04 28:15

so I want to know what is you know, something about mental wellness right now that that's talked about in the veterinary industry that absolutely drives you wild.

SPEAKER_06 28:24

Oh yeah. Okay, that's a really great question. Um one, I think there's some really incredible people who are creating great content to help us have a better industry when it comes to systemic change and seeing what it is that we can do proactively. And so the content is being made, it's amazing, and it's just not something that is reaching the people itself so that need it. I realized in my role, um, especially with NBA when I was helping with all of the hospitals, um I was kind of deemed the well-being ambassador with a zero-dollar budget. But people, once they really got to know who I was, would reach out constantly when they were unwell. And yet, even with resources available, whether that be EAP and having connection to a therapist, the step to take that like actual appointment and to do it was not something that they would go ahead and do. And so that or the webinars that are out there, like the stressed and unwell professional, which is so many of us, is not going to engage in that content after work. So that's the hard part is that I I feel like there's so many people that have like a great uh a good heart and intention to help us be better. But so many of us hit a wall before we'll ever consider doing something different. And for me, my own personal journey is I did blame the industry. I was like hearing all of these other people who do not work in veterinary medicine and their advice on how to take care of yourself. And I would just be like, but you don't understand. I would love to be able to get up really early, go move my body and take care of myself. But when I did not sleep the night before, because I was spiraling from the day of maybe things I could have done better, then I don't have enough sleep to do those things for myself. So people who give advice just don't understand. But I learned later that it really is possible. I had to see it though. So I I've now collected a lot of other vet professionals who are integrating better care. And a lot of times it's uncomfortable that I'm watching them do it and I'm sharing that with others. So I think black and white is there's there's hope and there's resources out there that people are often unaware of or just don't have the bandwidth to take advantage of it. So that's part of like what Boop is hoping to do is grab your attention. And as part of like, hopefully we'll get into kind of the philanthropic side of our brand, we give back to these resources to make sure that funding is there because that's being cut across all companies who would otherwise hire people to provide this well-being webinar. And so we want to make sure these resources don't disappear and that you know about it and maybe normalize using it. So that's a big thing.

SPEAKER_00 31:17

I think it's I mean, I sell benefit plans, right, to bet practices, and so when we talk about EAPs, they're like, Yeah, we just want to implement one. I'm like, no, no, no. This is like one thing to pay for, it's a whole other thing to implement it. And less than three percent of EAP programs are actually utilized. Yes. And that's like across the country. That's not just in vet medicine. But then I work specifically with an EAP and build one out for veterinarians and that or the vet community, I should say. And now we have utilization that's like well over 10% in in all of my groups that I do business on. And part of it is just educating that it exists and that they feel like, oh, there's 29 providers in Alberta alone that understand compassion fatigue. And once you say that, they're like, these people understand what I'm going through.

SPEAKER_06 32:04

And what I would love to see is, I mean, leadership needs to model using those resources, right? Like whenever we are not doing well, even if it's just a check-in and we feel like we're doing okay, like leading by example to say, I'm taking advantage of these resources. And I hope that you will too, because we all know that if you do get in a bad spot, it's it's a lot easier to engage and seek out help when you're not in a pit of despair, right? So, you know, trying to reach out early and often is always going to be the better way to have longevity and thrive in this career. But there's so many of us who don't want anyone under that hospital roof to know. I don't want anyone to know that I'm struggling. It seems like everyone else can hang and deal with this, and I'm the only one that doesn't. And so we're really trying to save face and like just the bandwidth to engage. Like there's just not a good modeling of it. And I would love to see that that be part of an onboarding, honestly, so that when you start at a hospital, it is part of your onboarding to go ahead and just go through the process of getting connected to someone just for a check-in, so that you are signed up, familiar with the process, and you just kind of know what to expect.

The Leadership Problem in Veterinary Medicine

SPEAKER_02 33:18

And and that's it. Oh, sorry, something I noticed in the operation space when I entered VetMed was we can talk about well-being and mental health all day long, but if we are sending people back into environments that are just not fit for their well-being and sustainable enjoyment of their work, it's all for nothing. And so the thing that gets me, gets my goat around the well-being conversation is that there's a lack of spotlight placed on a lack of leadership overall. We can have a hundred million well-being programs and the EAP program can be rolled out and it can be onboarded. But if leadership in the profession overall and the system doesn't change, um, the workplace will continue to be as challenging as it is and require so much focus on well-being. It's not an easy profession at all. Um, but I see as someone coming out of the profession into this industry and earning my right to speak, is there's a leadership issue in vetmed that not really many people are talking about. And I think for us, it's it's a holistic view of advocating for the profession overall. And we talk about systemic change as being one of them. And it's not just well-being, even though those are the resources we point to. Um, we also want to rally from the rooftops to say, it's not you, it's not you failing to access your well-being program. There's other things that are impacting you that are actually out of your control unless we all start talking about it. Totally.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

Yeah. And well, financial peace for one of them is a huge problem. Uh trust me, it's my life every day. But even leadership uh dealing with someone who's going through a mental health crisis, they don't actually know how to handle it. Like I had a situation where an employee went to their the practice owner saying, I don't want to be here anymore. And that poor owner was like, I don't know how to handle this. Right?

SPEAKER_09 35:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:13

And and I have all these programs implemented for them, but they don't, they just call me and say, What do I do? Right?

SPEAKER_04 35:19

That's scary. So what do you guys think what what's the answer to our leadership problem?

SPEAKER_02 35:25

Were you here an answer? It's what we talk about is it just being, and this is sort of how boop came to be as mission-driven as it is, is we realized not one practice becoming a great practice to work in is going to change the profession. Not one VMA providing really great leadership and systemic sort of incentives for individually owned or corporately owned practices to operate in such a way that is sustainable for human life. Like that has to be a whole system-wide change. And for us, like getting that grassroots movement going for with veterinary professionals to say, don't you want better? Don't you, don't you feel grounded enough to say, I deserve better, I demand better, because that's what's going to change employers and how they approach keeping their employees when their employees are empowered enough to say, this environment doesn't deserve me. Um, I want more.

Are We Scaring the Next Generation?

SPEAKER_04 36:21

What do you guys think about like, because one thing that I worry about is um we talk about burnout, we talk about compassion fatigue a lot, all important topics, but I worry that we're scaring um new grads or people who are even thinking about veterinary medicine, and then especially might scare them out of leadership positions. So, how do we balance the making people aware of what's going on in the industry while also being like, but it's real fun, I swear.

SPEAKER_09 36:51

Don't worry.

SPEAKER_06 36:52

Yeah, you'll love it. Well, as someone who's like really had a full view of what it's like to work specifically with early career veterinarians in these last several years with this newer generation, especially. I mean, the the bridge of like what it means coming out of practice versus being really ready for the reality of really any kind of practice. Um, it's it's a big gap. And the biggest gap is often what does the reality look like of what is difficult? One, I hate that um there's the idea that you should be day one ready because no matter what happens and where you go to vet school, that's never going to happen, especially when a good vet professional, regardless of role, is always looking things up and learning, right? So we need to come and like with that type of mindset and be able to really integrate more of what the reality is into the school and start early when it comes to how to have difficult conversations. Like what happens when you are now in a hospital, you're the doctor, and you feel very confident now that you want to make this decision, but the associate who's been here longer does not think that's the right idea. And you don't want to rock the boat. And so often that means that you're gonna default to what they would do. And then that can certainly lead to a poor outcome. And then that is just a confidence destroyer. So having that awareness around those types of issues that are going to show up no matter what hospital you work in, those things have to be discussed and talked about very early before you're, you know, actually out and have to do that. Because most of the time you learn the hard way by what happens to your soul when you aren't engaging in healthy conflict and speaking up for yourself. And so that shift really needs to happen when it comes to finding that way of being able to put reality into school. How that's going to happen, I'm not quite sure because there's quite a disconnect for those who actually are in academia being completely unaware of our reality. So I'm hoping that again, in as we all continue to have conversations, that there can be just more of a united front of how can we all learn and work from like a place of what do you know and what do I know? And how can we lean on resources and expand upon having someone who's a bit more on that resilient side. Um, because yeah, I don't want to, I don't want to scare um anyone, but I think Rochelle said it really well in leadership. Um, being able to make sure that that is the the veterinarian who's running the team is the hospital. It's the culture, it's the medicine that you're practicing. Um, it's the reason why a hospital was wonderful or not when I went into all of those hundred hospitals. And the one thing that would set them apart is is this a veterinarian who feels like we're all in this together? Are they gathering feedback? Are they trying to integrate psychological safety? Because it's the environment. No one ever leaves the job. And burnout's um an umbrella term, right? But it's the environment. And so if it has to have that collective feel.

SPEAKER_00 39:57

So

Resilience vs. Endurance

SPEAKER_00 39:58

do you think then that vet met has confused resiliency with endurance?

SPEAKER_06 40:03

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 40:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 40:04

Absolutely. Do you as well?

SPEAKER_00 40:06

1000%.

SPEAKER_06 40:07

Yes. Yeah. It's just like keep going. Yeah. Keep going. You'll get through it. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and just like you'll you'll bounce back or you're not meant to do this. Yeah. Um, and that's that's not the case. I'll tell you one thing that would have probably changed my whole career is if I had worked in my early years in an environment where we had like a rough day or a poor outcome, and it really affects every single person on the team. And if instead of walking to my car and carrying that home alone, if we had just spent five minutes to say that was really tough. And what did we do well? What could we do better next time? And maybe that was like we literally did the best that we could, and it's just awful. And that we're in this together. I see you. I appreciate the hard work that you do. Um, if anyone actually needs additional support, I'm here. And I just don't want you to carry that home alone.

SPEAKER_00 40:59

Like if that is that consideration. Yeah. Right? It's like we've lost that as humans. We have. Like, oh, are we considering what someone might be feeling or going through? Going through whatever they just experienced.

SPEAKER_02 41:11

I've heard from leaders too that say, wow, that was an awful day. That was a really shitty day. Will that quack? That was a really shitty day. That was a shitty day. And the leader says, that was awful, but I don't know how to respond to the emotion, so I'm scared to ask. So there is consideration, but there's still that lack of that muscle memory, that that leadership DNA that is often just by chance that we find great leaders in vetmed. It's because they've got the DNA, maybe, but not because it was a learned skill in this incredibly intense program that they went through to become veterinarians. So I agree with Dr. Amanda that there's some room in the academia portion of a veterinarian's journey to talk about the soft stuff that isn't so meaty and clinical, but is actually arguably probably the most important part of the endurance piece.

SPEAKER_00 42:05

It's interesting because mental health is medical and we like have no soft skills for it. It's like, oh, you're having a bad day, so am I. Right. It's like a copy of the Why are you worse than me? Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_02 42:18

Let's compare notes on your trauma.

SPEAKER_00 42:20

And it's not like empathy or sympathy anymore, and it's like what happened, like crying together.

SPEAKER_04 42:24

Well, and I also love that you guys talked about empathy statements there, because we think about it for our clients all the time to make an empathy statement, but just being able to say it was a really shitty day, and like acknowledging how bad the day was, sometimes for yourself, you can say an empathy statement for yourself, right? To be like, that really sucked. And then it's almost like you get the weight off of your shoulders, but especially when a leader acknowledges it. Yeah. And it doesn't mean that you have to fix what happens. No, it's just processing. Yes, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 42:56

That's

How Vet Teams Process Trauma

SPEAKER_06 42:57

a system that we can use to make things better for us, is to process trauma. Like that's what we're experiencing on such a regular basis. I'm actually taking this from Rochelle because this is something that she said early on, and it just blows my mind that two who haven't actually intimately worked in vet hospitals know as much as they do. And Rochelle beautifully said that with all the trauma that people experience working in the vet industry, there's just no systems in place in order to process that in a healthy way or at all. And so firefighters, other first responders, they have that. And we don't. And so I I think it was it was last year that I came across these psychological health and safety guidelines. And that's something that actually is like a blueprint for veterinarians that was, I think, conjured up by a group of Canadian veterinarians, always got to be Canadians, right? They're the best.

SPEAKER_05 43:49

And that they actually have to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_06 43:55

I love it though. And so it actually is meant to be like, you know, like OSHA. Comes to other health and safety guidelines of making sure I'm not sticking myself with a needle. But this is also like we just went through something traumatic. How do we process this individually and as a team? So the tools are being made, but the bandwidth and the leadership to want to integrate that is the hump that we have to get over.

SPEAKER_00 44:18

And the time it takes to implement new things in our practice, right? You start to slow it down just to take like a step back. And then this someone financial gets involved. So you can't afford to do that, even though you can't afford to start losing staff. Because now you have people going on disability claims, and 39% of disability claims are mental illness, which is higher than muscle skeletal claims, in case anyone wanted to know. That's fascinating. Yes. So you're welcome for that. I love the staff. You're welcome. Yeah. So I sell insurance for a living. Um, but there's also one of my friends is a behavior psychologist, and she says there's a when-then trap that everybody gets into. When I get through this week, then I'm going to feel this way. But it never actually happens. It's just this psychological thing that you tell yourself to be okay. So you just start putting all these feelings down and down and down, you eventually explode or implode internally and cry or not.

SPEAKER_04 45:14

Oh yeah, I've been there. I mean, another thing that I love that you guys mentioned about boop, I think on our first Zoom meeting, um, was that the mantras can be you know external for everyone to see what you're wearing on your chest, uh, or you can just be wearing it underneath and it's for you to say as well. So I I love like to say to yourself as well. So I love that also that it's sort of um because I think uh of course, like it the leadership and the management and the culture of the hospital is all important, but there's also some on us as individuals to be taking care of ourselves and our you know mental wellness and all those sorts of things. So it goes both ways, and I love how that's a extra, extra way to be able to do that, to just wear it under what you're wearing if you don't feel like having it for the world to see. Right.

SPEAKER_06 46:06

Both are equally as important, like what I do as an individual and what we do as a team, and how I show up as a part of that team. And so I I don't want to like give anything away, but we have some really exciting things that are coming for boob that I think whether you want people to see it or not, or it's just kind of a long sleeve that you're wearing under your scrubs because it's a cold clinic, there's some really good ones that are gonna come out. Thermal underwear.

SPEAKER_00 46:30

I don't know why I had to pull that really close when I said thermal underwear.

SPEAKER_07 46:34

And whisper it. I mean, underwear.

SPEAKER_00 46:37

I don't know. Um, that's amazing because I will have it to wear when I'm feeding my horses in minus 40, which does exist for us here. Yeah. Not in Texas or Tennessee.

SPEAKER_08 46:46

But I think that's a really good call out though, too, because as we have been like building our team, building our brand, building our voice, something we've been really intentional about is not only like shining a light on the doom and gloom and you know, the challenges of the industry that feel really scary to those that are entering the profession sometimes, or you know, things that really need to be addressed, but also elevating voices of people who are offering solutions and modeling what strong leadership looks like and who are doing it right and leading wonderful teams and drawing boundaries. Like we recently participated in another podcast with Dr. T, who leads the collaborative vet. And he's a really great example of you know, a leader who is leading with empathy, building boundaries for his team so that they don't have to do it themselves, being really particular about a schedule to protect their work-life balance while still running a profitable clinic. Um amplifying voices around what it looks like for leaders to lead with care, lead with empathy while also prioritizing, you know, successful businesses. Same thing with the impact partners. You have a couple of incredible impact partners who are like offering solutions and resources for veterinarians and veterinary teams to take advantage of. So I think you know, something that we're really intentional about is like not only shining a light on the doom and gloom, but also amplifying the voices of people who are leading by example and doing amazing things and showing us that it can be done and like you know, influencing the profession for good.

SPEAKER_04 48:21

Well, and let's talk

How Boop Gives Back

SPEAKER_04 48:22

about that a bit because Boop is giving back to the people who are, you know, putting their voices out there for the rest of the profession. So tell us a little bit about what Boop is doing with the profits.

unknown 48:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 48:36

So they all love each other. I know. I could talk about that all day too. And I know all three of us could because it just matters so much to us. So I know that as we were deciding on the purpose and our mission that we wanted to be able to give back to the resources that seemed to be silenced, underutilized. And I think that's what really got to me in previous roles is just um I really had to search for these people. Like I it was my job was to find resources at zero dollars that actually moved the needle, that actually did something that was able to help you day one of I I see this resource or this webinar, and I can apply something tomorrow that's going to improve my life, even if it's small. But I had to work really hard to find them. So um, and that's really across the board when it comes to like all well-being resources. But um, as I was introduced to these um different organizations, one being the Veterinary Hope Foundation, um, which I worked with NBA. Um, so many people are working with this incredible foundation of well-vetted mental professionals that I mean, I've been to therapy and it's amazing. It took me way too long to go see one. And then when I finally did, it took several visits before we actually could get into what is the veterinary world and why would I maybe not be okay. And then you can skip all of that with this incredible group that provide free support groups throughout the year for very niche groups within the vet industry. So it feels like you're building community with your people. So maybe they're technicians, maybe they're Hispanic, whatever it may be that kind of helps you feel safe. And then you're just kind of led through specific topics that are deeply related to what you are actually going through. Um, so you're sharing experiences together with a small group of people, but also this that or this mental health professional is really helping you find a hopeful spin, a solution, like Ashley was talking about. And so, one, I just was floored by learning about them and that they actually were a free resource and that no one knew about them, not enough people.

SPEAKER_00 50:39

I've never heard of it.

SPEAKER_06 50:40

Right?

SPEAKER_00 50:41

Now I want to go Google it.

SPEAKER_06 50:42

Yeah, so so they're amazing. So um, after meeting them in previous roles, I was like, we we gotta work with you. We gotta do something to where we can amplify the great things that you're doing so that the person who really needs you can find you. And so that was that's one of our impact partners. And the other one is Dr. Marie Holloway Chuck with Reviving Veterinary Medicine. Don't we all? She's the best. I mean, do I have a girl crush? Yeah, she does. A little bit. It's really nothing bad to say about it. No, Holloway Chuck. Oh my goodness. I got I got to finally meet her in person this year at the veterinary leadership conference, and I got really brave, and I was like, it's gonna be more than just me saying hello. I'm I'm gonna ask her to coffee.

SPEAKER_02 51:25

I'm gonna see if maybe like she'll sit down and pentomized her mirror self-clock by uh actually showed us what happened at ABM.

SPEAKER_06 51:32

If you're listening, Reap. And it worked, just stop listening. Um, but no, it was really great that she was like, absolutely, I would love to sit down and chat with you because we had met for um met virtually briefly in another role where she was so kindly giving a free webinar, I believe, to NBA just for you know well-being. Um but after just hearing her speak in several occasions, I just I haven't met that many vet professionals who make something so applicable. I'm just like nodding my head the whole time that she's talking, yes, I'm going through that. That would be a great thing I could have done instead, whether they be medical mistakes or just obviously how to attempt to be aware of your nervous system and regulate that as you're just running through this high stress day, day after day. And so I just I loved what she was saying and that I knew that this was something that could change my life tomorrow. So again, um hers is more of a for-profit business versus veterinary hope as a nonprofit, but we have very specific things that our um allocated funds will go to when it comes to like a crisis response um situation where, say, you lose someone really important in your practice, especially leadership, and no one knows what to do. Feels like the ceiling is caving in. So it's a great resource to kind of help a team through that. Um and I just I I'm always pointing people towards her her resources and mainly like she has so many that are free that just no one knows about. So we gotta check this out.

SPEAKER_09 52:56

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:57

Well, and like Marie, I will say Marie's a friend of ours. Yeah, like we love her. And when she launched her book, I literally bought 30 of them and I just start giving them out to students, and students are like so grateful because it's a DVM who have been where these students have been or are going.

SPEAKER_04 53:15

Well, and it's the whole thing that we were talking about where it's like we can't like mental wellness has almost become a buzzword where it's like, we'll talk about it, but are we actually actioning anything? Where Maria's like, this is these are the steps that you take.

SPEAKER_02 53:27

So it was so apparent to us from the very beginning that that had to be a focus. We had to give back to the profession. And we I was noticing, you know, budgets were stuck you were noticing budgets were starting to change around having marketing budget lines dedicated to well-being for certain organizations or learning development budget lines that would be going to people like Dr. Holloway Chuck that were just disappearing because well-being had become such a buzzword, and it was so 2024 and 25, and it feels like corporations are moving on. Yeah, and so we wanted to keep a spotlight on it by just saying, like, it's never gonna just be a buzzword for us, it's gonna be resources that are always applicable.

SPEAKER_00 54:09

Yeah, I think that's so important. Like, even in my practice, I have the I Got You Boo, and it's to raise money to put people through mental health first aid. That's some of them just for in the practice so someone can like recognize the style.

SPEAKER_04 54:23

Boo is her also her beloved dogs. Yeah, I got you boo.

SPEAKER_00 54:27

Yeah, girls that yeah, but I think it's so important that we never stop shying that light. Like, that's I have a huge problem with Bell with talk tape because why is it just one day? Right? Like And why does Belle get the free marketing? 100%. Like, this is every day, people. It's not just one day I wake up and I feel like shit. It's every day that you might feel like you're going through something, right? Like grief doesn't just happen for all a day. Grief is an asshole. We've talked about this with other guests early long. He's like, what should I not say when someone's grieving? You know, and then you have to just like stop and think about word choice. Like it's hard. It is, you know?

SPEAKER_04 55:04

Yeah,

Rapid Fire with Boop

SPEAKER_04 55:05

yeah. Well, um, I wanna do maybe so. We are gonna do a hot take where we're gonna get you guys to have some hotlings and give us your hottest takes. Um, maybe while we're getting that ready, we're gonna go through some rapid fire questions with you guys.

SPEAKER_00 55:19

Is there anything that you have not talked about that you want to talk about before we get into this?

SPEAKER_08 55:24

Just we gotta I think the one thing we gotta say is that yes, Boop is an apparel business, but we're just getting started and we have so much more planned, right? Like we're starting with the apparel, but we have we're ideating every day. We're having to really like curate ideas based on our band fit bandwidth and like what we actually have the time for. But Boop is a movement and we see so we see we have such a huge vision for like what we can do, what we can influence, and how incredible this profession can be. So like stay tuned because we're just getting started.

SPEAKER_00 55:58

And if people wanted to donate through Boop, can they do that? Like aside from buying merch, like obviously.

SPEAKER_06 56:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 56:04

Are there other ways?

SPEAKER_06 56:05

I mean, I would say buy some apparel. One, you won't be sorry because it is comfy and you can wear it on duty and off.

SPEAKER_00 56:12

I'm like, is there like a financial one we can do that's like, you know, steady gate and boop? But like I was like thinking like financially fractious, but the fractious one's already there.

SPEAKER_02 56:26

Financially feral. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:28

I have one of that already. I do have financially feral.

SPEAKER_02 56:31

Ashley is our um, how would you how would I describe you as someone that you're you're kind of like you spend first, oh scrutinize later? My favorite business.

SPEAKER_08 56:42

I'm not rich, I'm irresponsible.

SPEAKER_04 56:45

I have so many things, so many things that I say that start with the phrase, if I was rich and a bit more eccentric, I would.

SPEAKER_00 56:56

And then she made me as a friend.

SPEAKER_04 56:59

All right, well, let's get into rapid fire. So just quick uh quick answers to this, but I want each of your takes on it. So uh first one is if you could wave a magic wand and change something in the veterinary industry, what would it be? Go with you first, Ashley.

SPEAKER_08 57:21

More conversation.

SPEAKER_04 57:22

More conversation.

SPEAKER_00 57:24

I mean, y'all want to talk.

SPEAKER_06 57:25

I mean, I would say that we would all be very united. So instead of all the separations between specialties and industry and school, like it we would all be working much more closely together and supporting each other.

SPEAKER_02 57:36

I would I would say just more conversation as well, of just talking to each other, not at each other, um and focusing on the solution instead of the like cyclical issues.

SPEAKER_00 57:47

Yep. Okay. Um I loved this question. That's what I'm just gonna ask because it was my favorite. Um, if Boob had a theme song, what would it be? I don't know.

SPEAKER_08 57:58

Taylor Swift, are you ready for it?

SPEAKER_06 58:01

Swifty in the house. I mean, it it is. I think maybe I mean I have to say it's the same. I mean, we've already had dance parties to it. It's it's a theme. It resonates.

SPEAKER_00 58:11

Okay, I love it.

SPEAKER_06 58:12

It is. Okay, all you all agree.

SPEAKER_04 58:14

So yes. Okay, okay. Um, I want to know this one for our vetmed peeps who are still on the floor every single day. What is the best wake-me up when you are feeling sluggish on the floor?

SPEAKER_08 58:27

So boring, but I say like a crispy apple. An apple gives you more energy than a nap.

SPEAKER_00 58:32

That actually sounded really good when you said it.

SPEAKER_08 58:35

I was like, I want an appropriate lady, it's a Fuji, whatever you want, or what do you guys call it?

SPEAKER_00 58:41

Galas in Texas.

SPEAKER_06 58:44

Gala. I know that's that's very elevated. I feel like you have to have your pinky up to handle.

SPEAKER_00 58:47

Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_06 58:48

Okay, so this is really just like anything that can re-energize the day. It doesn't have to be food. It doesn't have to be food. Okay. Yeah. Humor. Like, can what can we do to laugh, make light, and enjoy each other. I like it.

SPEAKER_04 59:01

I have a really dirty joke that I tell sometimes in the morning, like on a busy ER shift. Anyways, I'll tell you guys after because so dirty, but it makes all you guys in the world. Come on, well Caleo just crack us out.

unknown 59:13

No idea.

SPEAKER_05 59:15

It's so record. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 59:18

We love an unhinged joke for sure. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 59:20

That usually helps the team when they're talking about it. Okay, we got to sluggish, sluggish day.

SPEAKER_02 59:24

Yeah. This is gonna be really weird.

unknown 59:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 59:27

Um, I maybe would like wash my hands and feet, and it tricks me into feeling like it's a new day.

SPEAKER_08 59:33

Ooh.

SPEAKER_00 59:34

But not at a footspot.

SPEAKER_08 59:37

Sorry, I had but the second we got home, she said, I take it. I gotta I gotta wash everything off.

SPEAKER_01 59:43

Like, were they sweaty men?

SPEAKER_00 59:44

Like I don't anyway, we can talk about it later. Um, what is one veterinary myth you would love to debunk?

SPEAKER_02 59:54

That they're in it for the money.

SPEAKER_00 59:56

Oh, 100%. Obviously. Oh god.

SPEAKER_02 59:59

That that they make a lot of money. Yeah. I think both, and because that isn't necessarily the case at all. I am aware.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:11

That that that they don't have you and your pet's best interest at heart, always.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:17

I get it. I'm already sweating.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:21

Oh wait, we're gonna start.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:23

I'm scared.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:24

Um, Kaylee, in the front of the wing. Oh, you're sorry.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:28

Napkins.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:29

Napkins. There's another hot sauce in there.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:32

Everybody know what their hot bacon is gonna be?

SPEAKER_09 1:00:34

I don't even I'm not prepared.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:37

Oh, do you want to share a plate? No, we're oh we're good.

SPEAKER_08 1:00:40

How fun are these plates? I know, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:42

Um, nice workplay, Lonnie on the plates? Yeah. Dollar store. Mine matches my album.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:48

I love.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:48

Okay, well, we'll ask another rapid fire question while we're getting ready here. So who would play the boop crew in a movie? Who would you guys want to play you? You could answer for another person too, if you're like, oh, Rochelle is so, I don't know, Zendaya. She gives me Zendaya vibes.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:10

She's powerful. Right, you like that? I thought of In Hathaway for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:16

Oh, what a compliment.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:18

That's really good. Yeah. I align. I think so too.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:21

I was thinking Jennifer Garner.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:23

Oh mad.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:24

Because she's such a baddie in the show she's in right now. I'm like, oh wow, I love that.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:30

She's not just 13 going on 30 anymore.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:32

Not anymore. Amanda.

SPEAKER_08 1:01:34

I don't even know if I have what do you think? Okay, well, an easy answer would be Reese. I think Dr. Amanda has really resonated with.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:44

Can I say that I was secretly hoping somebody else would say that?

SPEAKER_08 1:01:48

We've always 100%. Yeah. Powerful but leads with heart. Yeah. Unapologetically herself. I have just. But not.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:59

El Woods. El Woods. I was going to say Merrill Streep.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:05

Oh, Batty. She can play anything. Right?

SPEAKER_06 1:02:08

Fatty. Yeah. Yeah, she's amazing.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:12

Okay. So let's read out some of the software we have.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:15

Oh, we're sticking with Zandiya.

SPEAKER_06 1:02:18

Let's give another one.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:21

Who's off of um that 70s show?

SPEAKER_08 1:02:25

Mila Kunas?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:26

Mila Coonis.

SPEAKER_08 1:02:28

Okay, maybe appearance-wise. Yeah. But like she's a little quirky and a little like She sang on American Idol.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:37

Canadian Idol.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:38

Canadian Idol, sorry.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:39

She's got the voice. She's got the hype. She's so powerful. Right. Who's powerful enough? Smart. Who is that person? Oh, does it exist?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:47

Does it have to be an actor?

SPEAKER_07 1:02:48

No.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:49

The the snowboarder. The the American snowboarder that won the Olympic medal, and she's like a rocket scientist.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:56

Oh yeah. What is her name? How do I not know this person? But she's checking out China was really mad at her. China was upset because she's China.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:03

No, she she's snowboarded for China. For China. But she's American. Something like that. I don't know. There's something. But she's like highly intelligent. Someone said, like, how do you keep up with like a male interviewer? Like, how do you keep up with your beauty routine or whatever? And she just like ate him alive. Okay, that's a shelf. That one. That's yourself. That one. So she's not an actor or actress. That is such a compliment. Thanks for. You know who I'm talking about, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:31

Yeah. Yeah. What is her name? She scares me.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:34

Yes. That's who it is. What's the name?

SPEAKER_08 1:03:36

Layla. Well done. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:39

Uh oh, sorry, what is her name again?

unknown 1:03:41

Ellie. L E L E U.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:43

Yeah.

unknown 1:03:44

I also feel like Sandra Bola.

SPEAKER_09 1:03:46

Oh totally. That's a good one. Love that.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:50

Can you hold up for a proposal?

SPEAKER_05 1:03:52

Oh, we went to Alaska. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:56

She was a Canadian. Yes. Yeah, that's it. Guys, I I'm scared. Speaking of strong, powerful women, I am sweating. Channel, your Sandra Bullock.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:09

Oh

Getting Ready for Hot Wings

SPEAKER_00 1:04:10

my god. It's just condensation that's tripping. Thanks. Okay, so. So do we want to start with just the rub, or do you want to add I think we go full blown?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:22

Well, how spicy is the rub?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:24

It's not, it's it's like delicious. Delicious. Delicious. I think we're not scared.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:30

So if you're like, so which one do we want to use? Is the real question. So should we read out what we've got?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:36

Okay, so we have spontaneous combustion. It's pretty hot.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:41

Yeah. Hot sauce from hell. Michelle's already dying.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:48

Oh, and there's chocolate milk. No one needs that. Devil's Revenge. Jesus, Leylon. Are these Dollarama? No. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:58

These are like from a proper like a store that only sells hot sauce.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:01

Ass blaster hot sauce.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:04

Sounds like a challenge.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:06

We have uh Bulldak. Bulldak, this one killed us. Hot sauce. This is Korean. And then this is my husband's choice.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:15

We love a Korean moment. We love Korean skincare. Is it similar? Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:19

Name for your bumble. Can I say that on air? And then my husband Ron, who smoked us these wings. I will do a chocolate milk. He got us the ultimate rebel, which has Reaper Ghosts and Ron. Ron.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:39

So chocolate milk. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:43

I have a feeling it's going to be needed. I have my bridge thingy. That's okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:48

I also have just chocolate bars. That also was helpful. Yeah, yeah. You guys are putting it in.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:53

Now I'm getting more nervous about how spicy this is because there's a lot of mitigating items. Also, just want to say Thank you for joining us because I heard you weren't gonna join us in this part of the segment.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:05

Do we have to do it with them?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:08

Thank you. Thank you. We are going to die. I think I'm the one who died, actually. It was terrible. I just disassociated. I was like, You don't apart to mentalize. I don't. I'm like, how do you do that? It's such a man thing to do.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_08 1:06:25

And you have your fridge thiggy, your fridge thiggy, so I got my fridge thiggy. Okay, so let's. What's the choices?

SPEAKER_04 1:06:31

I don't know. I say we each try a different one of these. Who wants the ass blaster?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:39

I'm not doing this one again. We've done this.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:42

You three can try this.

SPEAKER_08 1:06:43

Pick for me. I'm feeling brave. Yeah, yeah. I'm going to be brave too.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:47

Yeah. Like close your eyes up in your hand.

SPEAKER_07 1:06:50

I'm going to not answer and hope that people pass me over. I'll try this one.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:55

Okay, we've got to share one. We're still.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:56

That's going to disappear.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:59

No, she's just off the wings.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:01

Don't don't let Richel miss. Like she needs one. Hand it over to her, whatever it is. Who had the glass blaster? Oh that's a good one. I think Ashley didn't.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:10

Jillian, let's let's join spontaneous commands.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:13

I'm just going to make you a pile, but you've got to dip. Okay.

SPEAKER_08 1:07:15

Okay, you dip? Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. I like it. We're going to try. I like it.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:22

So we are going to eat the wings and then we're going to ask you the questions. Once they've been consumed.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:32

Oh, so we eat first. That's the rule. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:07:35

Okay. First, shout out to our chef Ron. Thank you so much. Oh, shout out Ronda. Thank you, Chef Ron.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:41

My response to your wings has nothing to do with your ability to cook. It's probably the sauce. I had to say thank you before I get into the hot sauce. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:49

Okay, do you know what we're going to do?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:53

Okay. I'm so scared. Probably the first one. Okay, are we are we eating now? Is like is it bite done? Yeah, yeah. Okay, cheers, ladies. Cheers. Thank you for participating.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:08

I'm not sick this time.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:13

It's got some cake to it.

SPEAKER_08 1:08:15

I thought it was gonna be delayed. It came pretty quick. It came pretty quick. It is building.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:26

It's building and being patient. You just looked at me like we were on the Titanic and we were both at the lifeboat, and you kind of looked at me like, are you gonna go? Am I gonna go?

SPEAKER_03 1:08:41

Why is giving me hiccups?

SPEAKER_05 1:08:43

I mean I love you. How many bites?

SPEAKER_08 1:08:49

I did another dip and then immediately regarded it.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:52

And then I need

Hot Takes: Corporate vs. Private Practice

SPEAKER_03 1:08:53

the rubric for success here. Amanda's going for the gold star. I always need the gold star or a certification. Okay. I'm gonna ask Dr. Amanda what's an opinion you have about the veterinary industry that gets you into trouble?

SPEAKER_06 1:09:12

All right. All right. Um I don't know if this necessarily gets me into trouble, except to say uh there's there's a lot of tension with corporate consolidator vet practices versus private practice. I definitely see pros and cons of both. And when it comes to what I've seen in the corporate structure, more often than not, it has been hard to see those who have never worked in a vet hospital make the decisions that deeply impact the lives of those that do the work in a negative way. And I've seen that time and time again. And I'm also here to say it is not us against them. There is definitely beauty to be found collaborating, learning each other's languages, how to run a better business versus what does it mean when I do this and change your entire life in the hospital? So that could certainly get me in trouble, but I think that there's there's hope in the future that we could all work together. Oh yeah. Totally. Totally.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:21

And my eyes start sweating. I don't know they sweat. I shouldn't have licked my lips this week.

Parental Leave & Better Workplaces

SPEAKER_00 1:10:27

I'm gonna ask Ashley because she's an American. Parental leave in the US. How can a practice do better?

SPEAKER_08 1:10:35

I'm embarrassed. She's panicking all of us. She's panicking. She's hiding. It's terrible. Huh? Um, this is as bad as this hot side. Is it as bad as the hot side? Yes, it is. I mean, I think we we have to expect better, right? The new generation coming into the workforce are, you know, we they get a lot of flack for being drawing boundaries and being hard to work with or being bratty, but they're also asking for what they need and what they want and what they want. And they they have high expectations and work is not everything. So I think like it's abysmal, and we need change and we need the new generation. My lips are burning.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:17

Yeah. So what I love about what you said is that I work in a male-dominated industry, so only um 80% or 80% of advisors in Canada are men. But if a man asked for what women are asking for, there would be no question. Sorry to say it, guys. And I and I love I there are so many men that I love in my life, but there are men that could totally get away with it. Totally.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:39

Just adding and at the end of the day, it's more it's better for business, right? If women are taken care of, families are taken care of, we have better PTO policies, it's better for business.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:48

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:50

Absolutely. I I never understood the really short um parental leave because I'm like what we'll see. Layla's like, please stop. Um my God. Yeah, it's always been interesting to me because I'm like, isn't it harder to try to cover for like a six-week leave than it is for like we have 18 months here in Canada?

SPEAKER_00 1:12:14

12 months paid.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:15

True, but we have 18 months leave. Um it easier to cover for 12 to 18 months, like find a someone to fill a contract for that length of time than it is for like six. Totally.

SPEAKER_08 1:12:27

To be more intentional about an actual plan and full coverage that leaves the team feeling supported and healthy versus we've got six weeks, four and a half, depending on what kind of medical procedure she had. We can probably just like make it work. That's exactly what happened.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:44

It's like it's skeleton. It's a band we're gonna do without still and because guess what happens after the 12 to 18 months? Usually your practice has grown and you need an extra staff member, and now you've just had someone who did a 12 to 18 month contract who would be a great shoe-in to fill in a permanent role.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:03

But I will add, in Canada, it's not like you're making millions on EI. No, so like I'll have people being like, should I just low like I'm a um they maybe they started locoming and then now they want to start family planning, and they're like, I think I'll just go be an associate just so I can get in my EI MAT leave. And I'm like, for your $2,000 a month, we could probably come up with a better plan than that. If we're planning, no? But it's not enough. If we're gonna live off $2,000 a month, and then you have a baby, they're gonna eat that, and diapers are that.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:37

Yeah, it's true.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:38

We're you just spit on me. I saw it. I saw it's a big one. That was a big I don't even know what that was. That was a little piece of chip. Tendon? Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:46

We're definitely not perfect up in Canada.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:48

No, we're not. But like it's better than what the US is off, right? But it still puts people in financial hardship.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:55

Yeah. Okay. Rochelle looks like she's in pain and disassociated.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:01

Everything.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:02

Like, Rochelle's having an outer out of body experience. I'm I'm literally going. Did I sign anything saying I had to eat the wings? I don't think I did. So wait to be shamed and then make a decision if I'm gonna have another bite. I mean, I'm making choices over here. I'm a trailblazer.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:17

I eat the whole wing and I'll eat a whole other one. I just I licked a lot of salt.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:20

Oh, did you eat two wings? Oh, you only had one.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:24

I didn't know the

Your Job Is Not Your Identity

SPEAKER_04 1:14:25

bone. She ate the bone. Okay, so Rochelle, I want to know what is something you have changed your mind about in the last five years. What's something people versus someone was successfully able to change your mind about? Hmm.

SPEAKER_08 1:14:42

Does it have to be professional?

SPEAKER_04 1:14:44

It doesn't have to be professional, no. I just I love hearing this because I think we sometimes, especially in vetmed, get stuck in our ways. So I I like hearing about when people change their minds.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:54

The first thing that comes to mind is in the last five years I left um human health and moved over human health, private equity-owned human health. Oh, okay. Um, and moved over to private equity-owned vetmed. Um and coming out of human health, I had really burnt out. I was in the space during COVID, um, working with seniors, and it was an awful time in in that industry. And I burnt out and um made a lot of shifts in my thinking around what how I was tying performance to worth and how if if I didn't perform at work, I wasn't worthy or I wasn't successful, and that my pace of performance wasn't necessarily the same as everyone else. I just sort of had a like come to Jesus moment with myself about how what what what what I was doing was serving me and realized that my identity is not my job and I can still perform for the business. I can still increase shareholder value without killing myself. Um, and even better, I can maybe actually just build something on my own um that can be meaningful and mission-driven that also doesn't require me to kill myself.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:03

I want to add to something to this because one of the things I tell grads is that being a veterinarian should not be your identifier. And they get so hung up on if I ask, like, who are you? They're like, Well, I'm a veterinarian. And I'm like, really? Is that that's how you identify?

SPEAKER_06 1:16:21

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:21

Right?

SPEAKER_06 1:16:22

And now there's I can't tell you how much I did for everyone.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:24

I think everybody has. I like I look at it like someone's like, Oh, who are you? I'm like, I'm a financial advisor, and they're like, Chillion, that's what you do, that's not who you are. But then my husband and I had this chat. This is how I ended up with a frog, where he said, I have no hobbies. He's like, You went from having all these hobbies to having no hobbies because all you do is work. And I'm like now, I started taking piano lessons again, like I used to play when I was a kid, because I was like, I just need one hour of something where my brain does something different. And what a difference does that make on a Monday night? Because Monday is the worst day of the week to go back to work. Anyway, so what is your identifiers before we have another hot thought? I I would love to know.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:05

I think identity is a very much a North American thing. Identity tied with profession is very much a North American thing. You go to Europe, you go to Latin America, that is not the priority in folks' lives. Yeah, it's very North American. And I would say my identity is my like the relationships I choose to keep and how I pour into them, yeah, um, and what fills my cup is like more where I relate to my dialogue.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:30

Yeah, for me, like of course, I was in the most harmful state of identifying as a veterinarian. And the industry validates that, encourages it, and like throws the flame on it. And it took me way too long to really try and put boundaries up because the hardest part is you're saying no too often a patient in need or a client who needs you. And I'm like, I can't. And I did it. And so it was just a completely blurred line between Amanda the person and Amanda the vet. I was always available. And if I wasn't actively seeing a patient, I was probably reading a peer-reviewed journal or watching a CE webinar. I was just all about it because there is no way to know everything. And so I was just consumed. And so I kind of wore that as a badge of honor of like never being available for holidays. And I think maybe at some point, maybe in my life, I did have a hobby before I went to college. But then in college, my hobby was five jobs. How can I get into vet school? Vet school was the hobby, right? And then after there was just like, oh, that's what other people get to do. Other people get to play and do things, and this is the sacrifice I've made is to do this and to be there for my patients. And this is what it takes. Everyone else has shown me that's what it takes, and I'm willing to do that. So once I hit my really, really dark place, um, you know, I I was able to be around people, especially other vet professionals who gave me permission to be a whole person. And I just started trying it on. And I'm still honestly having the best time discovering that. I've done a good job the last, you know, several years of like paint by numbers. Yeah. That brings me so much joy. Kind of like surgery, with like how meticulous and the ones that I've chosen to do, but it's like something that allows me to disconnect. I think that would be great for all vet professionals and just every human. Whatever you do for work immediately after, do one activity that you enjoy for an hour that allows your brain to say, work is done, and now I'm a person. And what does that look like? And sometimes that's just a walk. A walk, getting outside, exploring, and travel is my favorite. But I love just still continuing to discover who that is. But I will end by saying, I feel like my deep purpose now is beyond the patient, which I never thought that would be the case. I you mean I I thought that you'd have to drag me kicking and screaming away from the dogs and cats I've had the privilege of caring for. But now I'm just so fiercely protective of the people who do this work because I don't feel like anybody or not many people in the time I really needed it were that for me. And so that's my purpose now. I just want people in our presence to feel like we see you. I hear you, you matter. How can I make your life and your world better in the industry as a whole? So that's the that's at least part of what I'm trying to do with a person and purpose. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:15

And I I I love that because I think like myself being an RVT, I same thing, identify so much with like being a caregiver that I'm like, that's just who I am. But then I had to zoom out at one point and be like, no, I like helping others, but there's so many ways for me to do that outside of my job that I go do every day. Um it's like helping with the environment, volunteering to do a cleanup. It's you know, it's it's helping people, even if it's my friend move or whatever the case may be. But it's like it took me a while to be like, no, it's not just going to a clinic and working on patients. It's I find purpose in helping, and there's so many ways to do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:57

But even you is like like how many people know, I mean a lot of people know now, but like how many people knew that you do zombie makeup and do the zombie walk?

SPEAKER_04 1:21:08

If if I ever retire from vetmed, I'm gonna go back to school for special effects makeup. But I'll show you pictures after.

SPEAKER_06 1:21:17

I feel like we should have gotten here an hour or so early for you to do that to us before we did this. That would have been fun.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:23

Ashley, how about you? What's your identifier? Oh, I shouldn't rub my eyes.

SPEAKER_08 1:21:26

Oh, it's it's such an interesting question, and we do such a bad job about totally building our identi our identity around our jobs and having stepped away from a corporate job for the first time in my life about six months ago, and really being able to like analyze well, how do I spend my time now? You know, and a lot of it is finding meaning in an endeavor that we started. Um, a big part of it is, you know, the relationships that I cultivate, taking care of my senior pet. I can't believe how much of my day I spend listening for her, spending time with her, taking care of her. Um, and then also self-care, moving my body, doing therapeutic activities that, you know, just feel good for the purpose of feeling good and fueling yourself. It's watering plants, it's doing puzzles, it's shopping. Um, it's shopping. Oh, love shopping space. Yeah. Remorse for we're not rich, we're air. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:31

Listen, once you spend money, like if you get rid of it, it will always come back. Someone at Home Depot yesterday asked me about my Louis Vuitton. I had like my LV wallet, and he's like, I want to go to Louis Vuitton and buy a purse. And I'm like, you do that. He's like, are they expensive? I'm like, yes. But if you give money away, it will come back to you. So treat yourself. And you're not sure. Unless I'm saying that dangerous thing to myself.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:58

So that's why I have the luggage I have because I'm so I And you take care of I do take care of this luggage, but like I was breaking suitcases every year, and I'm like, suitcases are like 500 bucks. And then so I did the math, and I'm like, if I'm replacing this every year, it's gonna take like girl math. I'm just gonna go buy designer luggage, and that's what I did because they'll replace it for the five. We're here for girl math.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:22

There's a soulmate moment happening. Yeah, yeah, it's an investment.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:25

I will send you pictures of my luggage, and like I own it, like at the end of the day, I travel so much, and I'm so sick of like everything breaking. I went to Kelowna, it's like an hour flight for me. They the airport had to ductate my luggage together because it broke on the airplane. And I'm like, F this noise. I'm never dealing with Louis Vuitton. Yeah. 100%. The only answer is 100.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:48

What other choice did you have?

SPEAKER_00 1:23:51

But I will will it to someone. Ava, you get my luggage.

SPEAKER_08 1:23:56

She will in the decades of joy that that luggage is going to bring up. 100%. And it's a conversation starter, too.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:03

And if you ask our accountant, he also has the matching set, but in blue. So when we travel together, we look like bougie assholes.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:10

I love it. Yeah. Are you guys okay, bro?

SPEAKER_00 1:24:14

We gotta do Ron's hot sauce. That's the only way. Okay. Ron spent a lot of time with this.

SPEAKER_08 1:24:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:19

Okay, you ready?

SPEAKER_08 1:24:20

Load me up with a wing.

unknown 1:24:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_08 1:24:22

I've still got a wing, so I'm good.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:25

Say if we go over.

unknown 1:24:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:26

I take advantage, Layla. You shouldn't give me that opportunity.

SPEAKER_06 1:24:29

You gave permission. Oh, yeah, that's a healthy pour. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:34

Anyone else need more wings? I'll take one extra. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:39

Kaylee, how many are in there?

SPEAKER_03 1:24:40

There's two.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:41

Generous soft pour you got. That is very generous. Kayleigh, you want to do one?

SPEAKER_03 1:24:45

No.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:45

You don't have a hot take?

SPEAKER_03 1:24:46

You can touch my number.

SPEAKER_05 1:24:48

Absolutely. That's what she said. Swamp. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:50

That's shirt right now.

SPEAKER_06 1:24:52

Okay, Michael Scott. Okay. I'm so here for Michael Scott. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Wait, I need a question.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:00

Don't we eat and then question? We gotta let it burn for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:05

Ron is better being delicious. It smells hot already.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:16

It's yummy.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:18

It does taste good. That's what I was about to say. I can tell right away this is gonna be a slow burger. Yeah, right. But it tastes really good.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:27

It does taste good. Asplaster was like right away on your mouth, uh, like your lips, and this is like back of the throat.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:34

Ass blaster was first on your lips. That's the title of the podcast. It is.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:41

This taste tasty. It's good. It is good. I'm sweating, but it's tasty. I don't hate it. Hot take. I prefer the ass blaster. Really?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:53

Okay. All right. Holy shit. NASK. I don't do hot. I am a white girl.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:06

It's the lips that got me. Yeah. Okay. Um yes. You know I do.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:14

Um

Does Unlimited PTO Work in Vet Med?

SPEAKER_04 1:26:15

I'm gonna ask Rochelle, what are your thoughts on um unlimited paid time off? Do you have you heard of unlimited paid time off? Yes. Okay, okay. You looked at me perplexed. She has opinions. You looked at me perplexed, but paid opinions. I I I'm curious what your thoughts are on paid time off. I've got my own opinions on it, but I want to hear yours. Or sorry, unlimited paid time off. In the context of a veterinary practice. Yeah.

unknown 1:26:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:44

Yeah. Do you think are you pro? Are you against? Are you or do you have stipulation?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:49

I haven't thought about it. My first like huh, where you were like, do you know what that is? Yes, I'm just panicking. Because in my mind, I'm thinking there aren't enough team members to fill the schedule as it is. You know, in order to have our cake, we need to be able to make great cake. And we haven't made great cake yet to be able to enjoy that kind of moment.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:11

I ask because I've been asked this like when I was in charge of hiring out of practice. I got asked by several people about unlimited pay time off. So I'm curious. Um yeah. What?

SPEAKER_00 1:27:23

Try them out is not helping.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:26

I just don't know how it would work. Yeah. Because I haven't thought about it enough. But if I think about the schedules that I hear practices talk about, Jillian, are you okay?

SPEAKER_03 1:27:37

Jillian might need some unlimited paid time off. That is so hot. Right? Yeah, still like munching on it. No, but it it's limited hot. My lips are on fire.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:54

All right, all right. So don't you think though? Unlimited paid time off. If people just know it's there. Don't take advantage of it. Like my assistant, Liana, I don't know, she has worked she works so hard for me and she loves our clients and so she works hard for the like our clients. I don't care how much vacation she takes because vacation for her is never I leave my laptop at home. She like will check on things to make sure everything is okay. We have systems in place that she could take time off, but she will never take advantage of it because it's always there for them.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:28

I guess I think about it from the context of a scheduled CSR shift, a scheduled, you know, technologist technician shift. Not an admin.

SPEAKER_06 1:28:35

Right. Yeah, right. Admin? Yeah. It can make sense. But in a hospital, no, because I see it swinging either way. You do you you're you take advantage of it and you're gone all the time because you don't really care about what's going on with the team, which is a rare person. Yeah. Or you never take it because you know that your absence. Like, I mean, I've been sick, like ever, ever, ever been sick. I still go to work, right? Yeah. Because I know there's someone to cover for me. So let alone not take it. Which is a problem as well, right? It is. Yeah. If you had a limited time off, we still probably don't care.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:06

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:29:06

Well, the work's never done.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:08

Well, and one thing I'll say. So there's a couple when I was in an admin role, I had an opportunity to take unlimited paid time off, and I was like, oh, I can't wait. And then one of my friends is like, don't do it. Because you're the personality that you're going to feel guilty if you take more. Whereas if you have a set time off, make it big, make it like six weeks, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:27

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:28

And then and the business can plan for it then. Exactly. And they're like, because then you won't feel guilty about it because it's written in stone. Whereas if you do have take six weeks when it's unlimited pay time off, because they've almost put the burden on your shoulders. However, I did see something similar work once with uh shift workers where a bunch of us want a time off over the summer, and the manager was like, here's the schedule. You guys just need to make it work. I'm happy as long as all the shifts are filled, and we sat there and figured it all out.

SPEAKER_07 1:29:55

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:55

Some of us only took, you know, three days off, some of us took two weeks off, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:00

In a past life, I worked in retirement homes and we were exploring this world of self-led teams where we just don't have any managers. And we had we had in our organization such high trust teams and really great leadership. So, what could the business look like if frontline team members could earn more?

SPEAKER_03 1:30:19

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:19

That salary could be absorbed by frontline team members and they could be trusted to lead themselves. What a novel idea. They leave our doors and they go negotiate mortgages and live their big lives and raise children. But when they come in to our business, we put them into a box. I can see a world where VetMed could have more leadership accountability at all levels where that is possible. And the team can negotiate sort of when everyone's taking time.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:45

Until people stop acting like the hunger games, then because that's the reality in some praxes. Like it is wild. KU2. You ready?

unknown 1:30:56

Oh fuck.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:58

Well, I literally am going to curve this up all the way home.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:01

Are they still there? They're still there. No, they're gone. She's gone.

Give Pet Owners the Gold Standard

SPEAKER_00 1:31:06

Uh, what's one question you wish people would ask you but never do?

SPEAKER_08 1:31:14

Okay, I do have a hot take here, and it's more from like a not a co-founder boop angle, it's more from like a pet parent angle and my personal experience in vet hospitals as a pet parent, as a client. I love this. And that is that I want to be pitched the gold standard full package every time. Like instead of, I've had so many experiences over the course of, you know, taking care of now my senior pet over the course of her lifetime and really wanting to do right by her, where I think veterinarians are filtering what they pitch to me as you know, a package that they think I can handle or would be generally willing to accept, or what their clientele generally would be comfortable with instead of just telling me everything that they would do for my pet if I was gonna say yes to everything and money was no option. Like, I want you to tell me everything and let me tell you no. And I realize that like there are many reasons why, you know, veterinarians don't always do that. But my hot take is give me the gold standard, give me the full rundown, the full diagnostics, and let me tell you no before you like, you know, distill down the recommendation that you give me because you think I'm I wouldn't agree to it.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:37

I think that's a great thing for you to say it like at the beginning of the consultation, because I think so many veterinary professionals have had trauma where they say, you know, the they've been scared to do that.

SPEAKER_06 1:32:49

Okay. So then they're just like, I won't, or I'm gonna hold back. Yes. Because actually it's like the client, anyone and everyone would ever want, especially in senior pet land. Like there is not a thing that her dog does not have as far as just remarkable.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:04

That's what they sweat and it comes back.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:08

I'm like, for her even though.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:09

I'm the financial advisor in this relationship, and I'm telling you. But I also think that vet teams project, like they project their own feelings around money, yeah. Of what they are trauma. Yeah, it's all financial trauma. And if we don't deal with the trauma, then we we can't move forward. Like one of the questions I'll ask any new client that comes on on the individual side is what was money like growing up or talking about dinner table? How did you guys talk about money? And it's either my parents thought about it, we never talked about it, or I had a single parent. And then you know, okay, well, let's talk about that. But people develop their emotions around money by the age of seven.

SPEAKER_09 1:33:45

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:47

So now they're just projecting to you of like you can afford to do this for your senior daughter.

SPEAKER_08 1:33:52

Totally, totally. Yeah, and it's such an interesting perspective that like our relationship with money is built so early on. Yeah. Um again, I think there's just been some missed opportunities. You know, I think we recently were talking about dentals. Like no one, no veterinarian, and I've had incredible veterinarians throughout my pets' lives. But until my dog was eight years old, no one ever talked to me about, you know, dentals or that I should be, you know, even brushing her teeth at home or like giving me additional options. It was like only once it became like a must-do did it even become part of the conversation. So as a pet parent, I've just, you know, always thought I want to know my options so that I can really do right by her and make, you know, an informed decision. See, perfect line. Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:43

We we did a dental on our senior dog, poor Grizzy, rest in beast. 2500 bucks. They had two removals. He was a whole new dog when those teeth were gone. And like Ron and I told our vet Mandy, we were like, everyone should do dentals because it's unbelievable how the behavior changes. Because they can't tell you they're in pain. And now he's like eating kibble and doing his yeah, anyway.

How Corporate Leaders Can Better Support Hospitals

SPEAKER_06 1:35:10

I could be on a dental soapbox forever, so I won't. Next podcast. Yeah, I am. Um as far as a question, um, I think just because of my last four years having um been in a corporate setting and having so many relationships that I've built with those who support veterinary hospitals. Um, I think one question that I always would love to have had from those who again would be field leaders and and on the corporate side, not the hospital side, would be what can I do? How can I develop in order to better support hospitals, to better understand hospitals? What and having just a curious mindset. I mean, if that would just be a door, and it did open for many, but it took a whole lot of time to build relationships and a lot of trust building in order for us to even skirt around having that conversation. But I would love if that is just like a bold ask by anyone who ever supports veterinary hospitals. Because I'll give you an answer.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:09

Yeah, fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:11

Yeah, all right. Well, ladies, thank you so much for being on the Don't Call Me Caddy podcast. We're so happy that we can make it work. This is um new for us to be in to be in a studio. We loved learning more about boop. We uh can you tell the audience how people can get a hold of you guys or check out boop and if there's any other final thoughts you want people to know about boop before we sign off.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:35

We should do a boop giveaway.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:36

Oh, we should.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:37

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Sorry, I just threw that out there. But we're saying that's from us.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:41

Yeah, there we go. Okay, yes. Um, you can find us on Instagram at boop apparel and wearboop.com. And our newest drop just came out July 1st, so there's a lot of new mantras on there and new colors. Fantastic.

What’s Next for Boop

SPEAKER_04 1:36:54

And uh, I forgot to ask at the beginning too, when did you guys officially launch? Because this is pretty new.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:59

We we had our little naive conversation, but how hard could I be? In November, we incorporated in February we went soft launch to our family and friends April and Live to the World um April 25th on World Veterinary Day. So we've been live a little under 80 days. Yeah, and we just did our second drop, and our next drop is a very exciting one. We're doing a collaboration with the uh Latinx VMA for Hispanic Heritage Month in September. So we're in Calgary shooting that, another little surprise collaboration with Dr. Holloway Chuck. Oh fantastic and our winter drop. So we're very busy over the next few days. We're seeing Dr. Marie actually in two days. Um, and we have some familiar faces that we'll be modeling um for this upcoming lines that are dropping.

SPEAKER_04 1:37:49

Fantastic. And yeah, I so I had to go, I went out and bought a boop shirt because I I want to be the one who has the vintage boop shirt. So in like 20 years from now, I can be like, this was the very first boop shirt that came out. It was the first line ever, and I'll have the vintage one. So go out and get your vintage boop shirts right now.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:12

They're all good. They're all coming, but we're gonna look great. Yeah, and they wash very well. Yeah. I wore this in PEI and it's like pull it out of the dryer, and I'm like, because I just did laundry. Yeah. Because I've been sick for three weeks.

unknown 1:38:26

But yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:38:27

All right. Well, thanks again for being on the show. Thank you. Thank you for having us. It was a blast.

SPEAKER_07 1:38:32

Thank you. Thank you.